Nuno Santos interview–surfer/musician Part I

"life has been pretty much music and waves and mountains"

On his music background…

NUNO: Grew up 5 miles outside of Nazaré. The ocean has always been my playground. The same with music. When I was a kid I started playing music when I was 5. At the same time I started, I’m not going to say surfing, because back then was not really surfing, it was body boarding with no fins. Just playing in the ocean. These are two things that have always been side by side.

VESTIARIA, Portugal

NUNO: Everybody needs to try to achieve something, not only personally, but also, socially. I would say that if he spends a long time in the middle of strong elements such and the ocean or the mountains, in the middle of nature, everything becomes relative, except helping someone else. Because in very extreme situations you understand the value of other people’s help and then giving back and just being available to help others. And I would say that these environments whether it’s big waves or mountains… I just spent a little time in the mountains also.

Things are so extreme and you're so out of control and this particularity which is you stop and think not only about yourself but about people around you, and not only the people but the environment around you. I think that raises some questions you have. You start questioning yourself. Why do I do this. Is this just for pure selfish reason? Is it just for me or should I use this to do something.

I’ve been involved in several things along my life and I hope to keep on doing them in the future and standing for, what I believe is right and I would say that these are principles that in the western societies that are well accepted that are the right way to live, we know that there are some countries in the world that don’t thrive in the same way but yea we need to stand for what we believe. Obviously democracy, freedom and human rights and whats called the social responsibility in the environment. We really need to take action on that.

I was just thinking to myself, sometimes. I got friends and somebody was calling my attention recently. Because sometimes I can be having dinner with friends or just talking with friends and sometimes I can become very critical the way I talk. And it was actually my wife, she was just saying, "hey Nuno you need to stop being so critical because sometimes it’s not nice to be around you because you always criticizing so many things. People will start thinking you are crazy."

"It’s not nice to be around you to be so critical". That is the issue. If you have critical thinking it's not something you just think. You just have it on the weekends. You always have it. It’s part of you. It is actually a problem. Not a problem. It is a challenge. So keep the critical thinking on your mind and being able to survive socially. Because sometimes a lot of people with not agree with what you say or will see some problems in what you say. And it’s sometimes difficult to have this social and environmental responsibility because even if we discuss we know that now a lot of people are concerned with many social aspects with many environmental aspects. I do question sometimes how far are we concerned with that. That includes myself.

And I would say sometimes we are not really taking things seriously. Whether it’s the social responsibility or the environmental responsibility. We do it because we do it, I don’t think we believe in it as much as we should. So this is the challenge for us as a society for the near future if you want to leave a good environment for our kids we should start thinking a little more in a more emphatic way, in a more critical way.

KEANE: It's wonderful that you bring that up. A lot of times in different parts of the world people just care about how much money can I make now and to hell with the environment so it's wonderful that you have that message to share with people. And you have a platform to express that.

In the end we always try to express our points of view to other people but I’ve been struggling with one little thought that I cannot overcome. Which is I have not been able to organize my backyard and who am I to change the world if I cannot change my own backyard. So I will give you an example. Teaching my parents to recycle. So as simple as this. Who am I to talk about environmental responsibility if I cannot teach my mother to recycle. Or who am I to talk about social responsibility and then, some things I cannot solve in my own village or town. That is also a challenge. You want to say something to the world but then you think to yourself, who am I to talk about this. I am the first one doing it wrong. Or for example, let’s take the surf world. We are all connected to surfing one way or another. But we talk about the environment a lot but we are one of the most polluting sports in the world. We use surfboards made of highly chemical products. We use wetsuits made of highly chemical products. Which are not recyclable by the way. Who are we to talk about the environment when we actually do really bad things to it. This little inside struggle which is ok, lets go and do something about it, but then you are like yea but I should start with my own backyard and then maybe I can go to the world. And this is actually quite chaotic in my head and yea, it’s a challenge.

Was Garrett McNamara the man who started everything with the waves?

Garrett was the person that started surfing very large waves. There is a story before, I started body boarding and before the jet skis and all, there were a bunch of crazy, crazy guys that would just try to go and surf on big waves. No on a regular wave. And so it was not really large surf. I'm talking about 10-15 foot surf. Not much more than that. But then Garrett came and obviously he opened the way to start surfing bigger waves because obviously he had the expertise to drive a jet ski and to tow into waves, he had all the experience he brought from Hawaii and he was the person that kind of like opened the way and found the best way to surf the waves here. So I would say that he was the person that started the big wave scene mostly because he was the first guy to surf very large waves together with his team and probably due to a long history, a lot of experience he brought from Hawaii and places he had travelled to, so yeah, he's the person that kind of started it all.

On meeting Garrett McNamara for the first time

NUNO: I was here the first day he came. I heard there was a guy in town that wanted to surf big waves. We have the beach on the town side and there is North beach which is the beach after the town. I was surfing alone and he came on his SUP, he was paddling and we met, we spoke a little bit and he invited me to go with him. I really wanted to go with him but at the time I had no experience, no equipment, nothing so I mean I really, really wanted to go so. But he started it all, driving jet skis and teaching everyone how to drive the jet skis there, obviously. It was a trial and error process. With a lot of error… {laughs} But the process was he began it all. We met right on his first day and we’ve been friends since.

RECYCLED SURFBOARDS AND WASTE

It's doing something about it. Just getting it all together and just use it. Another idea Keane which is… I was talking the other day with a bunch of friends. Which is the the problem of the waste, the things we waste. Starting in the food that goes to waste and going on, on, on… on goods and things we buy that we really don’t need or we don’t use it as much and that is a waste and a huge problem in our society more than anything else. I see that as the great problem. The waste, which is buying something, or consuming something without need. Now this can be very arguable because it’s difficult to just say: I need this, I don’t need that. Not to waste. Can we reuse something, for example, this is nothing. This might be nothing but all the surfboards that I have been having since I started surfing big waves have been second hand boards. I do it not just because it’s cheaper because I feel that a lot of times I get boards from professional guys that come and either they’re not happy with those boards or they got something better from a new sponsor, or whatever. Sometimes I keep those boards, sometimes I’m painting boards. I take those boards and in a way, just a simple way to avoid producing more trash. So I’ll use that board and it won’t go to waste, and I will fix it as many times as I have to. I have a tow board, which is my favorite tow board. I’ve probably broken it 3 times. And it always keeps on getting fixed and back into action. And just give it nice little paint and it’s all nice and beautiful. The problem with being fixed is not an issue because the wait is not a problem for the big waves and just these little things with the waste. This is just following what you said about the social responsibility about striving for what’s right. But that can be a big challenge. It’s not an easy one.

On waste in Portugal and the small towns

It’s actually a little more efficient. I would say the big waste comes from big cities. That’s what I see. But there is also more people. This is also arguable. But for example in my house. I live in a very small village. As I said. Everything that comes to the house, when it goes. We only produce one bucket of trash per one week and a half. Everything else either goes to recycling or the scrap foods go to the animals. I have goats, I have sheep, I have dogs. It just goes to the animals. A lot of the stuff we buy, we try to reuse whether it’s packages or… for example in my surfing stuff. I have everything, all my little pieces of equipment, I have them in old plastic boxes that were used to sell some kind of product, whatever that is. Kind of like little things and I would say that maybe life is more efficient. I’m going to say one for you to laugh a little bit. For example if you live in a small village you don't need to go to the toilet all the time and flush 10 liters of water everything is going to the toilet.

camping

KEANE: You have to conserve resources and water it is so important.

Do you go camping ever?

NUNO: Yes, quite a lot.

On the issue of liTTer in cities

That is a big issue because we are producing trash for our kids to deal with. I’ll give you an example of Portugal and probably the same applies to other countries. We’ve been consecutively in the last probably 100 years leaving debts to the following generations. In my country we had a dictatorship until 1974. So the people that came after which is pretty much my parents, the generation that took over the country and started like doing things because they were old enough to do it. They have a big democratic debt to pay because the country had been a dictatorship for 50 years. There was a lot of things to solve. After the big democratic debts came the financial debts. We’ve been in trouble economically and I’m now paying with my taxes the amount of corruption and the amount of problems and bad decisions that the politicians made. And then debt that my generations is leaving for my kid for the next generation is this garbage. It’s the environmental debts. It’s not right to leave problems for the ones that are coming after. I mean it would be correct to try to do things in a way that we do not leave problems for others to solve once we’re gone. And that includes the garbage. We just produce big landfills which destroys everything there. But is obvious that certain things are not recyclable. Certain things will stay there for many thousands of years and that’s not right. It’s just not right.

On cleaning the Pacific Ocean and other oceans of endless islands of trash

The problem will always be the same. It doesn’t matter how much you clean if you just keep on messing up.

KEANE: Do you think it is a state of mind with people to stop littering?

NUNO: It should start with education. It should start with the younger generations and little by little changing the problem because this is like… imagine you have a house and a bunch of people are always throwing stuff onto the floor and one person comes and starts wiping the floor, that’s amazing that person has an amazing attitude but it’s useless if the other people keep on littering the floor. So it’s not going to solve anything, we have to stop the problem where it starts. Let’s hope the future generations can do something more about it.

Nuno was born in December, 1980

When I grew up, Portugal wasn’t as developed as it is right now so it was quite a basic life I would say. There wasn’t much available. Not many things were available. For example for surfing. When I was a kid the first time I saw a surfboard I was like 14 or 15 years old. There were not surfboards at all. We had a couple of bodyboards, old ones. That was it so not much. It was quite a humble and basic life back then. A lot of times spent on the ocean for sure. A lot of time spent with music. Very basic life. Very humble life.

What is the Impact on Nazaré going from a small village to a large tourist destination. How do the people impact the environment and is it monitored?

NUNO: Amazing question Keane. That is the one million question. So the thing is like everyone else in the world, this increasing tourism coming from the big wave scene and just from the town getting known worldwide because of the size of the waves that has brought many tourists and investments. Obvious the town has grown considerably. Everything has evolved.

Obviously that’s a good thing. But at the same time the price of houses is not affordable for the common person from Nazaré. They can not afford the houses anymore. The house prices have gone so high up that nobody can afford the house now. In a way there is more jobs, there is more investment but at the same time people are now... are not able to buy a house anymore and I’m not even talking about first line in front of the ocean, I’m just talking about buying a house. Is it better, is it worse? Obviously it has become more international. Mentalities have evolved a little bit which is a good thing. There was investments and there’s more demand in tourism and all that which means there’s more money flowing. But I’m not sure if that means a better life for most people. I’m actually curious… that’s an individual perception. Each person will have to talk for themselves. It’s a question that I cannot answer.

When people come to see the season of surfing at Nazaré

We have the same season as Hawaii, the US so I mean the winter season is the time for big waves starting in October going up to March, April.

It’s very intense. It’s a very consistent place. We have big waves I would say every week. So there are swells all the time. This is the North Atlantic so it’s quite active. It’s a very active ocean so we tend to get a lot of swells throughout the season. That makes the place very consistent and obviously that is gaining a name internationally. So a lot of surfers are coming here because they know they can keep a high level of training. There is always waves. There is always a way you can paddle or tow. What ever you want. There is always an option here because there is always waves.

After a big surfing event, is there an issue with the garbage? Is it mostly recycling?

I would say that in comparison to other sports not as bad. I would say that the surfing public is a little more aware than I would say of other sports. So I would say that people are a little more considerate. I am normally in the water and I don’t come to shore to see what was the situation but I go there a couple days after. I don’t see much left behind so I’m happy with that. That way the surfing world might be a little of an example for other sports.

Taking on responsibility of jet ski rescue

That leads to an ethical question which is brings us back to the beginning of our conversation. Normally is not possible to surf Nazaré on a big day without a jet ski. It’s just not doable. Jet skis are the tool for getting into waves and to rescue. I’m not going to say it’s impossible, but it’s extremely difficult to be out there without a jet ski. I mean that’s what we did in the beginning and we just got pounded and got into trouble. So jet skis are mandatory and are very important to be there. Now, what’s happening in the beginning is I would go and help anyone in need and obviously I would still do it if I know there is somebody in trouble. I would go and try to help. But that has lead to a situation where some individuals come and they do not take full responsibility for their actions. So I mean if you want to surf here… first of all, they should consider if you know what you are doing and if have gathered all the safety and all the mechanisms for you to be there safely. It has happened for me in the past to help some guys. There was a particular situation where I went to rescue a guy and I ended up damaging my jet ski with a big expenditure in terms of repair and the guy just went away and he never asked how much that was. And you think to yourself… I just wasted my time, I risked my life, I risked my equipment and this guy comes here, he wants to get some waves and then he leaves and he doesn’t ask how much is it for the repair of the jet ski. So kind of like, should I help, yes of course I should help.

Somebody’s in trouble. Somebody can die. But at the same time that guy should take responsible for his actions. In the first place he should be there with a team with somebody skilled enough to drive a jet ski or surround himself with the right people so he can be surfing the big waves safely. You know, this is a gray area and what happens is that you kind of like have this group of people that you know and you will be there for them because you know that they will be there for you. But sometimes new people come which you don’t know, you don’t even know who they are and you don’t… kind of like, on the radio you get communications there is a guy dying or something like that. Everybody tries to help but we’re not paying much attention to what is outside of this circle of people I would say.

[Please tune in next week when we present part II of our interview with Nuno Santos.]